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MR2 toyota to honda ECU conversion harnesses


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#1 trucdoken

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Posted 20 March 2008 - 10:29 AM

I just bought 91 mr2 from pat. I was searching for an EMS for the MR2 and came across this forum. I'm a honda guy, so I love this idea. Anyone own a mr2 done this before.

http://mr2oc.com/sho...t=Hydra Nemesis

Edited by trucdoken, 20 March 2008 - 10:29 AM.


#2 Jeeves

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Posted 20 March 2008 - 10:33 AM

Have to be logged in.

Runnin' drugs and droppin' bolts.
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486hp/494tq. 500? 600? Fuck if I know. @ 17.5PSI


#3 trucdoken

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Posted 20 March 2008 - 10:33 AM

if you dont have an account. here's the info.



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i have the stuff to make 5 more, pending a trip to the yards. I'M ONLY DOING THIS FOR LOCALS. i'm sorry, but if you're not local i can't build a harness for you, period. i'll answer questions as best i can so you can do it yourself though. i'm trying to get others locally running on this setup so we can develop an information base, and potentially a tune directory.

it would essentially just plug right into the toyota side and honda side with one set of shielded wires added through the firewall for the new distributor. i want this to be as cheap and DIY a solution as possible, but i have to cover some of the time and money i've put into it. i don't want to be a vendor. i'm not doing this to make money. i want to move the community in a direction that's been so beneficial to other makes, but i need to eat too.

so i'm asking $45 for the harness. keep in mind an average honda OBD2-OBD1 conversion harness costs between $70 and $120 (quite a profit margin they have, eh?)

to complete the conversion, you will need:

OBD1/2 honda distributor. candidates include:
-92-01 civic, any
-94-01 integra, any
-92-01 4cylinder accord, look for the TEC, not the hitachi.
-92-99 prelude

$30-300 depending on where you buy.

OBD1 ECU, candidates include:
P06, 92-95 civic DX (no VTEC, IAB control)
P28, 92-95 civic Si, del sol Si, any 1600 VTEC engine (VTEC, but no IAB control. easy to add IAB though)
P74/P75, 94-95 integra RS, LS, GS (no VTEC or IAB)
P72, 94-95 integra GSR (VTEC, IAB and knock. knock board is worthless though)

$50-150 depending where you buy.

a GM or honda IAT sensor. you can pull one off a car at upullrparts WITH wire leads for about $2. there are usually about 50 GM cars there with the right parts. honda parts will work too. it has to be mounted in the intake manifold. the cold start injector location works perfectly.

either of the above ECU or distributor can be found by searching on www.car-part.com. for the ECU, you can buy a junkyard unit and i can chip it for you, or you can buy already-chipped versions at www.xenocron.com. the pre-chipped versions are more expensive, usually $120-180. i'll do it for $25, parts included. takes about 30 minutes. i've done about 10 of them now and never had one that didn't work perfectly. i can also add hardware to them for things like IAB control and VTEC solenoid activation.

it will work with the stock turbo MAP sensor, but the tunes i have for my car are for a motorola 2.5bar sensor. it's pretty easy to change them though, as crome allows you to edit the pressure columns to whatever you need. just take a pressure column from another bin, copy the whole column and paste it to the column in your bin. then change the pressure heading to read the same in your bin and you're done.

you WILL have to get it tuned, either by yourself or a professional tuner. Ron at RS motors has experience with crome. Jordan at consummate tuning comes VERY highly recommended. i think xenocron.com has a crome tuner directory as well. i know there are more crome tuners around here. i know Ron, he's a good guy and knows what he's doing. i've never met Jordan, but i've been in an integra DA that he STREET tuned to 321whp at 7psi on pump gas.

so who's gonna take the plunge this winter?

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#4 Cysco00

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Posted 20 March 2008 - 10:35 AM

First off, you have to be registered on MR2OC to even see that thread. Second, it definetly sounds like a cool idea, although I don't know or have even heard of anyone actually doing it. Third, just get a Hydra Nemesis, or AEM!!! LOL.

Nice buy BTW...welcome to the MR2 family!!

Cisco C.

P.S. Were u at Smith's on Golf Course and Ellison getting gas the other day, say Monday or Tues.?

Edited by Cysco00, 20 March 2008 - 10:37 AM.

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#5 Jeeves

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Posted 20 March 2008 - 10:36 AM

What's the whole purpose? Run a Honda ECU on a Toyota?

Runnin' drugs and droppin' bolts.
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#6 trucdoken

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Posted 20 March 2008 - 10:40 AM

cheapest EMS you can find....and does all the functions or more compare to Hydra or AEM...

Edited by trucdoken, 20 March 2008 - 10:41 AM.


#7 trucdoken

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Posted 20 March 2008 - 10:42 AM

QUOTE(Cysco00 @ Mar 20 2008, 11:35 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
First off, you have to be registered on MR2OC to even see that thread. Second, it definetly sounds like a cool idea, although I don't know or have even heard of anyone actually doing it. Third, just get a Hydra Nemesis, or AEM!!! LOL.

Nice buy BTW...welcome to the MR2 family!!

Cisco C.

P.S. Were u at Smith's on Golf Course and Ellison getting gas the other day, say Monday or Tues.?


Not sure..I never get other gas other than chevron. I drive by that smith everyday to work and home..

#8 trucdoken

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Posted 20 March 2008 - 10:46 AM

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Quote:
Originally Posted by unknown
now for the question you ask..is i just want to know your reasoning, and i can question just cause sooo...--what do you figure you can benifit from hacking and converting for honda parts, just to do the samething as would if you owned the honda/acura-what a piggyback system? whats the differenece, why spend the 200 for conversion to hack the mr2 engine management system, then more on honda distributors, ecu, etc. than to just use a setup for the mr2? answer that with some facts and ill leave you alone.....



so you admit that you jumped in and criticized something you knew absolutely nothing about. finally! some honesty!

the fact of the matter is that with the honda distributor on the car (and most honda dizzies are good for a few hundred thousand miles), the honda ECU IS a standalone EMS. i have full control over fuel, ignition timing, rev limits, individual cylinder fuel trim (and there's probably individual cylinder ignition trim in the code that hasn't been found yet), cold start enrich, IAT enrich and timing adjustment, and all the other parameters necessary to make the car drive better than stock.

i can use whatever MAP sensor i want, i've added features like 2-step launch control and full throttle shift, i can run staged fuel injection if i want, i can set the rev limit as high as 12,000rpm if i ever were to build the engine for it, i can run whatever size injectors i want to, even up to 1600cc with the addition of a simple injector driver board, etc.

why not do this with the toyota ECU? well, the toyota ECU is pretty weak, honestly. it's designed to do the bare minimum to run the engine efficiently. the code mask is embedded directly in the processor, which means in order to change ANYTHING, you need an external memory board like the techtom unit (and as was previously stated, costs upwards of $1000 depending on the vendor, not to mention THEY are the only ones with the software necessary to re-burn a chip for you, and they'll charge you as much as $150 PER CHIP).

the work for the honda ECU has been done. it's out there, and the majority of it is FREE so long as you don't use it for personal gain. the honda ECU has been proven time and time again into 700WHP territory- territory where only a handful of MR2s have EVER gotten, and all of them were on $2000 standalone EMS.

you don't seem to grasp the concept that an engine is an engine is an engine. as long as the ECU has proper timing references, it can control whatever you hook it up to. hondas are one of the most reliable mfrs on the planet, and their electronics practically NEVER fail for reasons other than user-error.

also, i didn't cut into my harness at all. i made a jumper harness, as Jordan mentioned, that plugs directly into each and has an extension to the honda distributor. the only cutting necessary was a single wire for the IAT sensor in the cold start injector location, and that's a cut you'd have to make with ANY EMS you decided to go with that eliminated the AFM.

again, THIS IS NOT A PIGGYBACK CONTROLLER! THIS IS FULL STANDALONE CONTROL OF THE ENGINE FOR A FRACTION OF THE COST OF AN AFTERMARKET EMS. it's proven, it's reliable, it just plain works.

you must be one of those folks that lives by the mantra "you get what you pay for." you don't seem to understand that you don't necessarily have to pay for it with money.

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#9 Fred

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Posted 20 March 2008 - 11:33 AM

How about you just swap in a K20 like everyone else and have 220whp out of the box instead of 125? Either way it's a lot of work but at least you end up with a good drivetain that responds very well to modifications.

just my 2

#10 Cysco00

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Posted 20 March 2008 - 12:41 PM

QUOTE(Fred @ Mar 20 2008, 12:33 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
How about you just swap in a K20 like everyone else and have 220whp out of the box instead of 125? Either way it's a lot of work but at least you end up with a good drivetain that responds very well to modifications.

just my 2


How do u figure a 3SGTE puts down 125whp?? Mine, stock put down 234whp.

I don't understand you saying that thiis can do more than an AEM or Hydra, those are full standalone's as well!! What can this do that those can't, other than supposedly save you money by going this route?

Cisco C.
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#11 trucdoken

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Posted 20 March 2008 - 12:58 PM

QUOTE(Fred @ Mar 20 2008, 12:33 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
How about you just swap in a K20 like everyone else and have 220whp out of the box instead of 125? Either way it's a lot of work but at least you end up with a good drivetain that responds very well to modifications.

just my 2


what the heck are you talking about..turbo mr2 does not have 125hp, and why would I swap k20 in a mid-engine, rear wheel drive. The question is for a ecu harness conversion.

#12 trucdoken

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Posted 20 March 2008 - 01:02 PM

QUOTE(Cysco00 @ Mar 20 2008, 01:41 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE(Fred @ Mar 20 2008, 12:33 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
How about you just swap in a K20 like everyone else and have 220whp out of the box instead of 125? Either way it's a lot of work but at least you end up with a good drivetain that responds very well to modifications.

just my 2


How do u figure a 3SGTE puts down 125whp?? Mine, stock put down 234whp.

I don't understand you saying that thiis can do more than an AEM or Hydra, those are full standalone's as well!! What can this do that those can't, other than supposedly save you money by going this route?

Cisco C.


Honda ECU is a stand alone ecu with neptune/hondata/crome ect. It can control everything that hydra and aem can.

quote from:

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basically, this gets you full control over fuel and ignition. it's essentially a standalone engine management system with most of the features of something like a hydra nemesis at a small fraction of the cost.

keep in mind too that crome is not the only editor out there for honda ECU's. for some $$, you can use hondata, neptune, or the forthcoming eCtune (which would potentially blow nemesis out of the water).

some features that crome does have:

- full fuel and ignition control.
- scalable and selectabe boost columns. you can choose your boost pressure resolution.
- individual cylinder trim control
- add-on features like full throttle launch and full throttle shift.
- ability to use a wide variety of MAP sensors (eliminates the AFM).
- datalogging capability. the datalogging in crome free does not work, you need crome pro to datalog in crome, but there is a freeware datalogger called 'freelog' that works very well.
- real-time programmability with some extra hardware. no chip burning.
- it's CHEAP. this setup could potentially cost less than a megasquirt if you know where to shop. this swap could potentially cost less than just replacing your AFM if you shop wisely.
- better driveability. even on my semi-tuned engine, throttle response is better than it ever was with the stock ECU. the engine doesn't load up with fuel when blipping the throttle like it did with the AFM. it feels overall more responsive, and doesn't have any of the cold start hesitation that the toyota computer invoked..
- the ability to put multiple maps on a single chip. the SST27SF512 chip is twice as big as it needs to be to hold the calibration file. we can burn a seperate map to both ends of the chip- one for street gas, one for pump or E85, etc- and use a switch to switch between the maps.
- use the VTEC solenoid output to control staged injection or anti-lag.

--------------------------------------------

Hondata:

Features

Main features:

Fits inside the ECU
Made in USA
Built on the proven s100/s200 code base
USB connection for speed and compatibility
SManager Windows based software for parameter & table editing, calibration uploading and datalogging.
Real-time updating of ECU
Built in calibrations for common engine combinations
Built in datalogging to a laptop
On board datalogging memory (2 MB memory, 20-60 minutes datalogging)
Adjustment for different sized injectors, with overall fuel trim.
Configurable for any MAP sensor (to at 5 Bar and above)
TPS based table lookup for ITBs
Engine protection from over boost.
Expanded fuel and ignition tables, both in rpm and load, to 60 lbs boost and 11,000 rpm (these are not the upper limits)
Launch control with anti-lag
Full throttle shift
Three multi purpose outputs for nitrous control or similar
Supports lambda tracing from a wideband o2
PWM output for boost control
Dual tables for high/low octane calibrations etc.
Two analog inputs for wideband, EGTs etc.
SManager editing software features:

High and low speed 24 x 20 ignition and fuel tables for correct VTEC tuning
Injector size fuel trim
Fuel trim for starting, throttle tip in and individual cylinder trim
Rev limiter with fuel cut or fuel and ignition cut
Launch control with anti-lag
Full throttle shift
Adjustable VTEC window with load and throttle control
Secondary intake runner control
Adjustable idle speed
MAP sensor type and calibration
Adjustable boost cut with hot and cold settings
Shift light
Closed loop control
Air temperature compensation
Water temperature compensation
Fuel and ignition correction based on gear
A/C shutoff conditions
Closed loop
Three general purpose outputs for nitrous control, quad boost control or similar
On board datalogging trigger conditions
The s300 uses different connecting pins in the ECU from the s100/s200, and also has a slot cut in the side for the USB connector, so the ECU must be modified for use with the s300. The s300 is made to fit in a full frame ECU case (US and most markets), so will not fit in a JDM ECU case.

Edited by trucdoken, 20 March 2008 - 01:02 PM.


#13 Cysco00

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Posted 20 March 2008 - 01:09 PM

QUOTE(trucdoken @ Mar 20 2008, 02:02 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Honda ECU is a stand alone ecu with neptune/hondata/crome ect. It can control everything that hydra and aem can.

Cool, so they basically can do all the same thing, except the later is cheaper!! Cool...sorry I don't know that much about Honda stuff!! LOL. Would definelty be interesting to pull off, only......isn't it like a cardinal sin putting something Honda into something Toyota???? scared.gif

Cisco C.
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#14 trucdoken

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Posted 20 March 2008 - 01:47 PM

QUOTE(Cysco00 @ Mar 20 2008, 02:09 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE(trucdoken @ Mar 20 2008, 02:02 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Honda ECU is a stand alone ecu with neptune/hondata/crome ect. It can control everything that hydra and aem can.

Cool, so they basically can do all the same thing, except the later is cheaper!! Cool...sorry I don't know that much about Honda stuff!! LOL. Would definelty be interesting to pull off, only......isn't it like a cardinal sin putting something Honda into something Toyota???? scared.gif

Cisco C.


Its not about honda in the toyota..Its about whats work best for the engine...

#15 Car_Fynatik

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Posted 12 April 2008 - 10:37 PM

They are both from Japanland, so its okay.







Hopefully there are some solid base setups, building a tune 100% from scratch could be a real pita.
Or maybe its not? GL either way.
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